[Servercert-wg] Voting period begins: Ballot SC-066: Fall 2023 Clean-up v2

Thu Oct 19 15:05:17 UTC 2023

On 19/10/2023 4:51 μ.μ., Inigo Barreira wrote:
>
> I disagree.
>

That's unfortunate because the language in the Bylaws seems unambiguous. 
It doesn't say that the Chair is allowed to make /any/ minor change but 
has an explicit set of changes. Even changing a bulleted list into a 
numbered list would be a formatting change, but that is clearly not allowed.

> >Perhaps I’m misunderstanding what you’re saying, but changing the 
> formatting/content will require a new version of the ballot with 
> associated new discussion period and voting period
>
> This proposed change by Ryan is not changing the content not 
> adding/removing anything. The issue is due to the artifacts and the 
> generating of the PDF. If you review that proposal, you´ll see that is 
> to harmonize the GitHub and PDF styles.
>

The Git version is the canonical version, so in order to meet the 
Bylaws, even if you change a full-stop , you must follow the process of 
another round of discussion with the updated formatting change and then 
start the voting.

Thanks,
Dimitris.

> *De:*Corey Bonnell <Corey.Bonnell at digicert.com>
> *Enviado el:* jueves, 19 de octubre de 2023 14:21
> *Para:* Inigo Barreira <Inigo.Barreira at sectigo.com>; CA/B Forum Server 
> Certificate WG Public Discussion List <servercert-wg at cabforum.org>; 
> Dimitris Zacharopoulos (HARICA) <dzacharo at harica.gr>
> *Asunto:* RE: [Servercert-wg] Voting period begins: Ballot SC-066: 
> Fall 2023 Clean-up v2
>
> Hi Inigo,
>
> Comments inline.
>
> > the chair of the CWG can perform some changes that do not change 
> anything without requiring a ballot procedure, so I guess there´s 
> nothing to vote/discuss there
>
> Perhaps I’m misunderstanding what you’re saying, but changing the 
> formatting/content will require a new version of the ballot with 
> associated new discussion period and voting period. This should be 
> clear from Bylaws 2.4 (8), as modifying arbitrary formatting does not 
> fall within the allowed set of post-voting changes that can be 
> performed by the (Vice) Chair.
>
> > The change proposed by Ryan is just a simple issue with the format 
> and it´s not changing the content nor anything else.
>
> Some members do see the formatting of these documents as significant 
> and will vote accordingly. See [1] for a recent example.
>
> I agree with Dimitris: if this formatting change is to be included, 
> then the ballot redline needs to be updated to incorporate the changes 
> and the appropriate commits included in the immutable link. To do 
> otherwise will likely result in confusion, as members will be unsure 
> on what they’re voting on.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Corey
>
> [1] https://lists.cabforum.org/pipermail/cscwg-public/2022-May/000810.html
>
> *From:*Servercert-wg <servercert-wg-bounces at cabforum.org> *On Behalf 
> Of *Inigo Barreira via Servercert-wg
> *Sent:* Thursday, October 19, 2023 7:56 AM
> *To:* Dimitris Zacharopoulos (HARICA) <dzacharo at harica.gr>; CA/B Forum 
> Server Certificate WG Public Discussion List <servercert-wg at cabforum.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [Servercert-wg] Voting period begins: Ballot SC-066: 
> Fall 2023 Clean-up v2
>
> Well, my interpretation is that this is not changing the ballot 
> itself, the redline still remains the same (there´s no change in that 
> redline) and only if this ballot passes, at the end, and before 
> publishing, and considered section 2.4, item 8, the chair of the CWG 
> can perform some changes that do not change anything without requiring 
> a ballot procedure, so I guess there´s nothing to vote/discuss there. 
> The change proposed by Ryan is just a simple issue with the format and 
> it´s not changing the content nor anything else.
>
> *De:*Dimitris Zacharopoulos (HARICA) <dzacharo at harica.gr>
> *Enviado el:* jueves, 19 de octubre de 2023 13:26
> *Para:* Inigo Barreira <Inigo.Barreira at sectigo.com>; CA/B Forum Server 
> Certificate WG Public Discussion List <servercert-wg at cabforum.org>
> *Asunto:* Re: [Servercert-wg] Voting period begins: Ballot SC-066: 
> Fall 2023 Clean-up v2
>
> CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do 
> not click links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender 
> and know the content is safe.
>
> On 19/10/2023 12:43 μ.μ., Inigo Barreira via Servercert-wg wrote:
>
>     The voting period for this ballot has started. Note that
>     Inconsistent document formatting (Markdown vs PDF) · Issue #462 ·
>     cabforum/servercert (github.com)
>     <https://url.avanan.click/v2/___https:/github.com/cabforum/servercert/issues/462___.YXAzOmRpZ2ljZXJ0OmE6bzpkNzA5N2FlMjBlMDk4NmRkY2NiY2JmNjRlMGI1NDJhOTo2OmQwZGU6ODNmNGU4MzdlYjdlM2NkMjk1MjZhZjYzMGE3N2FjNGQ3MjQzOWRkZDNmNjJhODRlMjIwMDViZGEwYjk1OTg3YzpoOkY>
>     will be also included (it´s a format issue with no content change).
>
>
>
> Inigo,
>
> You started the voting period on a specific ballot that has a specific 
> redline 
> <https://url.avanan.click/v2/___https:/github.com/cabforum/servercert/compare/90a98dc7c1131eaab01af411968aa7330d315b9b...b72da7a87955aed81d14f9fe96ee222098fd4264___.YXAzOmRpZ2ljZXJ0OmE6bzpkNzA5N2FlMjBlMDk4NmRkY2NiY2JmNjRlMGI1NDJhOTo2OjJmNTc6MmVjNGFmY2RlODE2YjY5ZmMyODg2NGIxZjJlODMzNmFiN2I3ZGJlZjBkNGI0YTlkMGQxYzdkYmUzMmU5YTY3NzpoOkY>. 
> That means you cannot make any changes without invoking a new 7-days 
> discussion period. Unfortunately, since you started the voting period 
> there is nothing you can do but either let the ballot fail or withdraw 
> it. Withdrawing a ballot is a new addition to the Bylaws in section 
> 2.3 (4)
>
>     A proposer may withdraw a ballot containing defective language at
>     any point during the voting period
>
>
>
> According to the Bylaws, the voting period ends 7 days after the 
> voting starts, so that would be 7 days from TODAY (2023-10-19), which 
> means that the voting ends at *2023-10-26*. The information at the 
> bottom of the page should have been updated.
>
> I'd appreciate a confirmation from at least another person that is 
> familiar with the Bylaws about whether my interpretation is accurate 
> or not.
>
>
> Best regards,
> Dimitris.
>
>
>
>     **
>
>     *Purpose of Ballot SC-66 v2*
>
>     This ballot proposes updates to the Baseline Requirements for the
>     Issuance and Management of Publicly-Trusted Certificates related
>     to the issues and typos that have happened due to the different
>     updates of the document. No new normative requirements are
>     introduced by the changes in this ballot.
>
>     Notes:
>
>      1. The majority of these issues have been documented in GitHub
>         and have therefore labeled as cleanup and have been the basis
>         for this update.
>      2. Some have been provided by emails to the CABF lists and
>         included in this reviewed version because were typos.
>
>     The following motion has been proposed by Iñigo Barreira of
>     Sectigo. And, endorsed by Aaron Gable of Let´s Encryptand Clint
>     Wilson of Apple.
>
>     *— Motion Begins —*
>
>     This ballot modifies the “Baseline Requirements for the Issuance
>     and Management of Publicly-Trusted Certificates” (“Baseline
>     Requirements”), based on Version 2.0.1.
>
>     MODIFY the Baseline Requirements as specified in the following
>     Redline:
>
>     https://github.com/cabforum/servercert/compare/90a98dc7c1131eaab01af411968aa7330d315b9b...b72da7a87955aed81d14f9fe96ee222098fd4264
>     <https://url.avanan.click/v2/___https:/github.com/cabforum/servercert/compare/90a98dc7c1131eaab01af411968aa7330d315b9b...b72da7a87955aed81d14f9fe96ee222098fd4264___.YXAzOmRpZ2ljZXJ0OmE6bzpkNzA5N2FlMjBlMDk4NmRkY2NiY2JmNjRlMGI1NDJhOTo2OjAwZTI6ZmMzNzJjNWNiNmIwMzhkYmQ3NjFmMjgzNmQ2NTNhZmExZGI3YzZkOWFjOTYwNDQ5MGNkZDg2MjgxNWU5YmI2ODpoOkY>.
>
>     *— Motion Ends —*
>
>     This ballot proposes a Final Maintenance Guideline. The procedure
>     for approval of this ballot is as follows:
>
>     *Discussion (7+ days)*
>
>     •                     Start time: 10-10-2023 22:00:00 UTC
>
>     •                     End time: 17-10-2023 22:00:00 UTC
>
>     *Vote for approval (7 days)*
>
>     •                     Start time: 18-10-2023 22:00:00 UTC
>
>     •                     End time: 25-10-2023 22:00:00 UTC
>
>     _______________________________________________
>
>     Servercert-wg mailing list
>
>     Servercert-wg at cabforum.org
>
>     https://lists.cabforum.org/mailman/listinfo/servercert-wg  <https://url.avanan.click/v2/___https:/lists.cabforum.org/mailman/listinfo/servercert-wg___.YXAzOmRpZ2ljZXJ0OmE6bzpkNzA5N2FlMjBlMDk4NmRkY2NiY2JmNjRlMGI1NDJhOTo2OmQyMGU6MTZiNGE4NmE1MTk4MjNmZTlhMzU2Yzk3NDA4ZTA0NDRlYTdjMDMzMjAxODliMzQ0NWI2ZTQ1YjRmZjk4OWFmNTpoOkY>
>
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