[cabf_validation] Proposed ballot - EV State Optional

md md at ssc.lt
Fri Dec 16 00:56:05 MST 2016


Right, however in case of counties like Lithuania, maybe Taiwan, these categories have no meaning. 
That's why we need the 'state or province' be optional only for countiries where it has no meaning, otherwise - Required.
Are you ok with this?
Thanks,M.D.


Sent from Samsung tablet.
-------- Original message --------From: Adriano Santoni <adriano.santoni at staff.aruba.it> Date: 12/16/16  09:41  (GMT+02:00) To: "Moudrick M. Dadashov" <md at ssc.lt>, CA/Browser Forum Validation WG List <validation at cabforum.org> Subject: Re: [cabf_validation] Proposed ballot - EV State Optional 

    Okay, but then - in my acception - "state or
        province" has a real meaning in both Germany and UK (do not know
        about Taiwan).... no?

      
    

    Il 16/12/2016 08:29, Moudrick M.
      Dadashov ha scritto:

    
    
      
      Hi Adriano,

        

        This is exactly what Tim proposed, whenever "state" or
        "province" has real meaning - use it, otherwise, its optional.

        

        Thanks,

        M.D.

      

      On 12/16/2016 9:10 AM, Adriano
        Santoni via Validation wrote:

      
      Including StateOrProvince helps disambiguating the
        address of the certificate holder, which seems to me an
        important information in both OV and EV certificates, and there
        are several cases where - given just a country and a locality -
        the exact location remains uncertain because of homonyms. 

        

        It is true that subdivisions named "state" or "province" do not
        exist in all countries, but in most countries other subdivisions
        do exist (eg. counties, regions, departments, Länder, etc.), and
        I do not see why those cannot be specified in
        StateOrProvince....they should, IMO. 

        

        Adriano 

        

        Il 15/12/2016 19:53, Bruce Morton via Validation ha scritto: 

         

          My concern with the list is that it will take some time to
          evaluate and come to agreement on 249 countries. Once that is
          completed, then we will have to maintain the list forever. 

          

          I think that the CAs have been verifying Place of Business
          appropriately, but the guidelines are just poorly worded. The
          result is we do not know how to handle countries with no
          states and countries that have states, but do not use them as
          part of the address. This also means that the auditor can
          state that we have problems when we either do not include the
          state field or falsely put information in the state field. 

          

          I would prefer that we just change the wording to as Tim put
          it, “if it’s in the address, it’s required.” If moving
          forward, we see a vulnerability with this method, then let’s
          at that time to consider the other method. 

          

          Thanks, Bruce. 

          

          *From:* Tim Hollebeek [mailto:THollebeek at trustwave.com]
          

          *Sent:* Thursday, December 15, 2016 1:41 PM 

          *To:* Kirk Hall <Kirk.Hall at entrustdatacard.com>;
          CA/Browser Forum Validation WG List <validation at cabforum.org>;
          Bruce Morton <Bruce.Morton at entrustdatacard.com>
          

          *Subject:* RE: Proposed ballot - EV State Optional 

          

          Yes I like that even better as we can all debate the merits of
          each case and agree on the correct handling so there is
          absolutely no ambiguity.  Each country does tend to have
          subtle differences when we’ve previously discussed this on the
          policy calls. 

          

          But people don’t seem to want to do that, and if they still
          don’t, I think “if it’s in the address, it’s required” is a
          reasonable low effort solution to move forward. 

          

          *From:*Kirk Hall [mailto:Kirk.Hall at entrustdatacard.com]
          

          *Sent:* Thursday, December 15, 2016 1:35 PM 

          *To:* CA/Browser Forum Validation WG List; Bruce Morton 

          *Cc:* Tim Hollebeek 

          *Subject:* RE: Proposed ballot - EV State Optional 

          

          Another possibility is to leave state or province as required,
          but then add: 

          

          “State or province is not required for the countries listed on
          Appendix X” 

          

          Then we add places (Taiwan, Monaco, Vatican City, Germany,
          United Kingdom) as people bring them forward.  We could
          include an initial list with this ballot to avoid having to
          prepare another ballot to add places. 

          

          *From:* Validation [mailto:validation-bounces at cabforum.org]
          *On Behalf Of *Tim Hollebeek via Validation 

          *Sent:* Thursday, December 15, 2016 10:26 AM 

          *To:* Bruce Morton <Bruce.Morton at entrustdatacard.com
          <mailto:Bruce.Morton at entrustdatacard.com>>;
          CA/Browser Forum Validation WG List <validation at cabforum.org
          <mailto:validation at cabforum.org>>
          

          *Cc:* Tim Hollebeek <THollebeek at trustwave.com
          <mailto:THollebeek at trustwave.com>>
          

          *Subject:* Re: [cabf_validation] Proposed ballot - EV State
          Optional 

          

          Yes, I like something along those lines. 

          

          *From:*Bruce Morton [mailto:Bruce.Morton at entrustdatacard.com]
          

          *Sent:* Thursday, December 15, 2016 1:25 PM 

          *To:* Tim Hollebeek; CA/Browser Forum Validation WG List 

          *Subject:* RE: Proposed ballot - EV State Optional 

          

          How about this? 

          

          Required/Optional: 

          

          City and country – Required; 

          

          State – Required, if verified per Section 11.4.1 as part of
          the address for the Place of Business; 

          

          Street and postal code – Optional 

          

          If there is no state or the state is not used as part of the
          address, then it is not required. 

          

          Bruce. 

          

          *From:* Tim Hollebeek [mailto:THollebeek at trustwave.com]
          

          *Sent:* Thursday, December 15, 2016 10:19 AM 

          *To:* CA/Browser Forum Validation WG List <validation at cabforum.org
          <mailto:validation at cabforum.org>>
          

          *Cc:* Bruce Morton <Bruce.Morton at entrustdatacard.com
          <mailto:Bruce.Morton at entrustdatacard.com>>
          

          *Subject:* RE: Proposed ballot - EV State Optional 

          

          But City + Country is not unique in many common, important
          cases (“Springfield, United States”), and the state is also
          important since state laws tend to vary quite a bit in the US
          … I think something more in the spirit of the current BRs that
          does a better job of tightening up what “where applicable”
          means would be better. 

          

          I don’t want to lose the requirement that US EV certificates
          MUST include the state. 

          

          -Tim 

          

          *From:*Validation [mailto:validation-bounces at cabforum.org]
          *On Behalf Of *Bruce Morton via Validation 

          *Sent:* Thursday, December 15, 2016 9:28 AM 

          *To:* CA/Browser Forum Validation WG List 

          *Cc:* Bruce Morton 

          *Subject:* [cabf_validation] Proposed ballot - EV State
          Optional 

          

          Here is a proposed ballot per my action. 

          

          Thanks, Bruce. 

          

          *Background*: 

          

          There is confusion on whether the state or province OID MUST
          be included in an EV certificate. EV section 9.2.7 states in
          one place “State or province (where applicable)” and also
          “City, state and country – Required.” 

          

          Since many countries do not have states or provinces and some
          that do have states or provinces do not use them for their
          address, it is proposed that inclusion of the state or
          province OID should be optional. 

          

          *-- MOTION BEGINS --* 

          

          /Current section 9.2.7 of EV Guidelines/: 

          

          *Required/Optional:*City, state, and country – Required;
          Street and postal code – Optional 

          

          /Proposed section 9.2.7 of EV Guidelines:/ 

          

          *Required/Optional:*City and country – Required; Street, state
          and postal code – Optional 

          

          *-- MOTION ENDS -- * 

          

          The review period for this ballot shall commence at 2200 UTC
          on XX, and will close at 2200 UTC on XX. Unless the motion is
          withdrawn during the review period, the voting period will
          start immediately thereafter and will close at 2200 UTC on XX.
          Votes must be cast by posting an on-list reply to this thread.
          

          

          A vote in favor of the motion must indicate a clear 'yes' in
          the response. A vote against must indicate a clear 'no' in the
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          the response. Unclear responses will not be counted. The
          latest vote received from any representative of a voting
          member before the close of the voting period will be counted.
          Voting members are listed here: https://cabforum.org/members/
          <https://scanmail.trustwave.com/?c=4062&d=4uLS2LctdUselJfNN_qKqhlUiQGKRBR1RnDgtqpA8A&s=5&u=https%3a%2f%2fcabforum%2eorg%2fmembers%2f>
          

          

          In order for the motion to be adopted, two thirds or more of
          the votes cast by members in the CA category and greater than
          50% of the votes cast by members in the browser category must
          be in favor. Quorum is currently nine (9) members– at least
          nine members must participate in the ballot, either by voting
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    -- 

      
        Cordiali saluti,

        

        Adriano Santoni

        ACTALIS S.p.A.

        (Aruba Group)
    
  
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