[cabfpub] Elections

Tue Jul 17 11:50:09 MST 2018

I agree with Tim - the Forum voting rules should not change.  There’s no reason that WG chair elections need to take place at the same time as Forum elections.  This doesn’t happen in other standards organizations - elections happen on their own timetable.  It might be less confusing if they happen in a staggered manner rather than all at once anyway.  

Best regards,

Virginia Fournier
Senior Standards Counsel
 Apple Inc.
☏ 669-227-9595
✉︎ vmf at apple.com <mailto:vmf at apple.com>

On Jul 17, 2018, at 10:40 AM, public-request at cabforum.org wrote:

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Today's Topics:

  1. Elections (Tim Hollebeek)
  2. Re: Elections (Kirk Hall)
  3. Re: Elections (Tim Hollebeek)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2018 16:01:18 +0000
From: Tim Hollebeek <tim.hollebeek at digicert.com>
To: CA/Browser Forum Public Discussion List <public at cabforum.org>
Subject: [cabfpub] Elections
Message-ID:
	<BN6PR14MB1106E73E1BA99ABFB00832B1835C0 at BN6PR14MB1106.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

As a reminder, we ended up with the current SCWG chairs and election rules
because we were unable to reach agreement on the election rules.  So we
punted it to the SCWG to handle once it was formed, to avoid blocking
progress on getting governance reform passed.  I don't see a good reason to
delay resolving those issues and having elections now that the SCWG exists.

I am extremely concerned that one of the proposals involves changes to the
election procedures at the Forum level.  I see no compelling reason why that
is necessary, and why the current terms and rules should not be left alone.
Attempting to modify the Forum elections as well will add complexity and
controversy with no added benefit.  We should focus on what the SCWG rules
should be, and agree sustainable long-term rules and a good precedents for
new working groups instead of basing proposals on short term considerations.
For example, it probably will not be possible for the WG elections to be in
sync with the main forum, if only because the S/MIME working group, which is
likely to exist very soon, won't exist soon enough to have elections in sync
with the main Forum.

-Tim

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Message: 2
Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2018 17:11:13 +0000
From: Kirk Hall <Kirk.Hall at entrustdatacard.com>
To: CA/Browser Forum Public Discussion List <public at cabforum.org>
Subject: Re: [cabfpub] Elections
Message-ID:
	<72c46d41bc784f7f9493a2d74984fda3 at PMSPEX04.corporate.datacard.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Tim - if future WGs are started mid-year, it would be easy to sync up the initial officer terms to the "standard" officer terms of the Forum and existing WGs - you just have either begin with a "short term" initial term (for example, "The initial term of the S/MIME WG Chair shall run from May 15, 2019 to Oct. 31, 2019.  Thereafter, terms of officers of the S/MIME WG shall run from November 1 of the election year through October 31 two years later."  Or the initial term can be a "long term" - "The initial term of the S/MIME WG Chair shall run from September 10, 2019 to Oct. 31, 2021.  Thereafter, terms of officers of the S/MIME WG shall run from November 1 of the election year through October 31 two years later."  Each new WG would have control of the initial term for officers, and can make it sync up to a standard two year term for all officers.

From: Public [mailto:public-bounces at cabforum.org] On Behalf Of Tim Hollebeek via Public
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2018 9:01 AM
To: CA/Browser Forum Public Discussion List <public at cabforum.org>
Subject: [EXTERNAL][cabfpub] Elections

As a reminder, we ended up with the current SCWG chairs and election rules because we were unable to reach agreement on the election rules.  So we punted it to the SCWG to handle once it was formed, to avoid blocking progress on getting governance reform passed.  I don't see a good reason to delay resolving those issues and having elections now that the SCWG exists.

I am extremely concerned that one of the proposals involves changes to the election procedures at the Forum level.  I see no compelling reason why that is necessary, and why the current terms and rules should not be left alone.  Attempting to modify the Forum elections as well will add complexity and controversy with no added benefit.  We should focus on what the SCWG rules should be, and agree sustainable long-term rules and a good precedents for new working groups instead of basing proposals on short term considerations.  For example, it probably will not be possible for the WG elections to be in sync with the main forum, if only because the S/MIME working group, which is likely to exist very soon, won't exist soon enough to have elections in sync with the main Forum.

-Tim
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Message: 3
Date: Tue, 17 Jul 2018 17:40:25 +0000
From: Tim Hollebeek <tim.hollebeek at digicert.com>
To: Kirk Hall <Kirk.Hall at entrustdatacard.com>, CA/Browser Forum Public
	Discussion List <public at cabforum.org>
Subject: Re: [cabfpub] Elections
Message-ID:
	<BN6PR14MB1106D29FB520015B6F094FB3835C0 at BN6PR14MB1106.namprd14.prod.outlook.com>

Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Or we could just avoid the problem by not creating it in the first place.

Speaking as someone who attended most of the governance reform calls, if we
learned one thing from governance reform, it's that simpler is better, and
gets us to consensus faster.

-Tim

From: Public [mailto:public-bounces at cabforum.org] On Behalf Of Kirk Hall via
Public
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2018 1:11 PM
To: CA/Browser Forum Public Discussion List <public at cabforum.org>
Subject: Re: [cabfpub] Elections

Tim - if future WGs are started mid-year, it would be easy to sync up the
initial officer terms to the "standard" officer terms of the Forum and
existing WGs - you just have either begin with a "short term" initial term
(for example, "The initial term of the S/MIME WG Chair shall run from May
15, 2019 to Oct. 31, 2019.  Thereafter, terms of officers of the S/MIME WG
shall run from November 1 of the election year through October 31 two years
later."  Or the initial term can be a "long term" - "The initial term of the
S/MIME WG Chair shall run from September 10, 2019 to Oct. 31, 2021.
Thereafter, terms of officers of the S/MIME WG shall run from November 1 of
the election year through October 31 two years later."  Each new WG would
have control of the initial term for officers, and can make it sync up to a
standard two year term for all officers.

From: Public [mailto:public-bounces at cabforum.org] On Behalf Of Tim Hollebeek
via Public
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2018 9:01 AM
To: CA/Browser Forum Public Discussion List <public at cabforum.org
<mailto:public at cabforum.org> >
Subject: [EXTERNAL][cabfpub] Elections

As a reminder, we ended up with the current SCWG chairs and election rules
because we were unable to reach agreement on the election rules.  So we
punted it to the SCWG to handle once it was formed, to avoid blocking
progress on getting governance reform passed.  I don't see a good reason to
delay resolving those issues and having elections now that the SCWG exists.

I am extremely concerned that one of the proposals involves changes to the
election procedures at the Forum level.  I see no compelling reason why that
is necessary, and why the current terms and rules should not be left alone.
Attempting to modify the Forum elections as well will add complexity and
controversy with no added benefit.  We should focus on what the SCWG rules
should be, and agree sustainable long-term rules and a good precedents for
new working groups instead of basing proposals on short term considerations.
For example, it probably will not be possible for the WG elections to be in
sync with the main forum, if only because the S/MIME working group, which is
likely to exist very soon, won't exist soon enough to have elections in sync
with the main Forum.

-Tim

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