[cabf_governance] [EXTERNAL]Re: Two topics for next Governance Change WG meeting

Dimitris Zacharopoulos jimmy at it.auth.gr
Fri Aug 31 00:50:12 MST 2018


On 31/8/2018 2:25 πμ, Virginia Fournier via Govreform wrote:
> This will need more discussion.  We’ll need everyone to be members at 
> the Forum (not SCWG) level so they’ll be bound by the Bylaws, IPR 
> Policy, etc.
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Virginia Fournier
> Senior Standards Counsel
>  Apple Inc.
> ☏669-227-9595
> ✉︎vmf at apple.com <mailto:vmf at apple.com>
>
>
>
> On Aug 30, 2018, at 2:43 PM, Kirk Hall <Kirk.Hall at entrustdatacard.com 
> <mailto:Kirk.Hall at entrustdatacard.com>> wrote:
>
> Virginia – our current Bylaws restrict certificate issuers to entities 
> with WebTrust for CA or similar ETSI audits that issue certificates, 
> and certificate consumers that rely on certificates.  Based on that 
> working, I think only CAs that issue SSL/TLS server certificates (with 
> WT or ETSI audits) and browsers that rely on SSL/TLS server 
> certificates qualify.  We could have a new IoT Device Working Group, 
> S/MIME Certificate Working Group, or other new WGs where the “CA” 
> members don’t have WebTrust/ETSI audits, and their “browser” members 
> may not require such audits.  So they wouldn’t be CABF Members under 
> our current Bylaws.  I think we need a change in the Bylaws if the 
> intention was that all WG members were automatically Forum members 
> with a vote.

Kirk, this is not an entirely accurate description of ETSI or WT, as far 
as I understand.

The certifications called out in 2.1(a) are not limited to SSL/TLS 
server certificates. They may be used for "Certificate Issuers" that 
issue S/MIME, Code Signing, Digital Signature Certificates, Client 
Authentication and others. I don't think we need to make any amendments 
on the "Certificate Issuer" part, except for the improvement regarding 
the audit criteria versions that we've already discussed and is pending 
to enter a ballot.

The description of "Certificate Consumers" is also inclusive for 
non-browser members, as long as they produce a software product intended 
for use by the general public for relying upon certificates. The only 
controversial spot that might be worth discussing is 2.2(a)- items 2 and 3:

"A Certificate Consumer Member's membership will automatically cease if 
any of the following become true:

 1. it is not a member of any CWG;
 2. it stops providing updates for its membership-qualifying software
    product;
 3. six months have elapsed since the last such published update."

There might be Certificate Consumers in certain business areas that 
don't update their software product every six months.


Dimitris.

> *From:*vfournier at apple.com <mailto:vfournier at apple.com> 
> [mailto:vfournier at apple.com]
> *Sent:*Thursday, August 30, 2018 11:55 AM
> *To:*Ryan Sleevi <sleevi at google.com <mailto:sleevi at google.com>>; Kirk 
> Hall <Kirk.Hall at entrustdatacard.com 
> <mailto:Kirk.Hall at entrustdatacard.com>>
> *Cc:*CA/Browser Forum Governance WG List <govreform at cabforum.org 
> <mailto:govreform at cabforum.org>>
> *Subject:*[EXTERNAL]Re: [cabf_governance] Two topics for next 
> Governance Change WG meeting
> On Aug 30, 2018, at 7:28 AM, Ryan Sleevi via Govreform 
> <govreform at cabforum.org <mailto:govreform at cabforum.org>> wrote:
>
> On Thu, Aug 30, 2018 at 9:36 AM Kirk Hall via Govreform 
> <govreform at cabforum.org <mailto:govreform at cabforum.org>> wrote:
>
>     Here are two issues for the Governance WG to discuss:
>     1. Move forward with Ballot Forum-2 – extending terms of CABF
>     Chair and Vice Chair
>     2. Consider revising Bylaw 2.1 (Forum Membership requirements) and
>     Bylaw 2.3(f) (voting rules).  As I understand it, the intent was
>     that ALL members of ALL new Working Groups would automatically be
>     Members of the Forum, and ALL would have an equal vote on votes at
>     the Forum level.  Is that correct?
>
> I don't believe so.
> VMF:  All members of all WGs will also be members of the Forum.  There 
> was no intent to change the voting structure.  There are still the 
> Certificate Issuers/Certificate Consumers categories, with the same 
> approval thresholds.
>
>     That’s not how Bylaws 2.1 and 2.3 read – they only allow CAs and
>     Browsers to be Forum members, and they still show voting at the
>     Forum level limited to CAs and Browsers (2/3 vote, 51% vote).  We
>     did move these same rules to the SCWG level – that makes sense –
>     but if we create new WGs with non-CA/non-browser members, they
>     won’t be able to participate at the Forum level.
>
> Well, browsers, mail clients, other certificate consumers. It's a 
> broader category than just the SCWG's notion of browser.
> VMF:  Each WG can set its own voting rules in its charter.  This in no 
> way affects the voting structure at the Forum level.
>
>     So we should (a) change those Bylaws at the Forum level (“any
>     Member of a WG is automatically a Member of the Forum, and all
>     votes equal at the Forum level), and also (b) add the current
>     voting rules to the SCWG charter (there are no voting rules there).
>     VMF:  No, this is not what was intended.
>     ******
>
>     *Bylaw 2.1 Qualifying for Forum Membership*
>
>     (a) All Forum members must participate in at least one CWG (as
>     defined in Section 5.3.1 below), and meet at least one of the
>     following criteria:
>
>     (1) Certificate Issuer: The member organization operates a
>     certification authority that has a current and successful WebTrust
>     for CAs audit or ETSI EN 319 411-1 or ETSI TS 102 042 or ETSI TS
>     101 456 audit report prepared by a properly-qualified auditor, is
>     a member of a CWG, and that actively issues certificates to end
>     entities, such certificates being treated as valid by a
>     Certificate Consumer Member. Applicants that are not actively
>     issuing certificates but otherwise meet membership criteria may be
>     granted Associate Member status under Bylaw Sec. 3.1 for a period
>     of time to be designated by the Forum.
>
>     (2) Root Certificate Issuer: The member organization operates a
>     certification authority that has a current and successful WebTrust
>     for CAs, or ETSI EN 319 411-1102042 or ETSI TS 102
>
>     042 or ETSI TS 101 456 audit report prepared by a
>     properly-qualified auditor, is a member of a CWG, and that issues
>     certificates to subordinate CAs that, in turn, actively issue
>     certificates to end entities such certificates being treated as
>     valid by a Certificate Consumer Member. Applicants that are not
>     actively issuing certificates but otherwise meet membership
>     criteria may be granted Associate Member status under Bylaw
>     Section 3.1 for a period of time to be designated by the Forum.
>
>     (3) Certificate Consumer: The member organization produces a
>     software product, such as a browser, intended for use by the
>     general public for relying upon certificates and is a member of a CWG.
>
>     *2.3 General Provisions Applicable to all Ballots*
>     The following rules will apply to all ballots, including Draft
>     Guideline Ballots (defined in Section 2.4).
>     (f) Members fall into two categories: Certificate Issuers
>     (including Certificate Issuers and Root
>     Certificate Issuers), as defined in Section 2.1(a)(1) and (2) and
>     Certificate Consumers (as
>     defined in Section 2.1(a)(3)). In order for a ballot to be adopted
>     by the Forum, two-thirds or more
>     of the votes cast by the Members in the Certificate Issuer
>     category must be in favor of the ballot,
>     and at least 50% plus one of the votes cast by the Members in the
>     Certificate Consumer
>     category must be in favor of the ballot. At least one Member in
>     each category must vote in favor
>     of a ballot for the ballot to be adopted.
>     _______________________________________________
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>     Govreform at cabforum.org <mailto:Govreform at cabforum.org>
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>
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