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    Hi Tim,<br>
    <br>
    None of the IETF standards set policy unless they are invited by
    some policy authority :) The BRs set such policy and "import" some
    documents, such as RFC 5280, 3647 and others.<br>
    <br>
    The BRs in section 1.1 state:<br>
    <br>
    <blockquote type="cite">These Requirements do not address all of the
      issues relevant to the issuance and management of Publicly-Trusted
      Certificates. In accordance with RFC 3647 and to facilitate a
      comparison of other certificate policies and CPSs (e.g. for policy
      mapping), this document includes all sections of the RFC 3647
      framework. However, rather than beginning with a "no stipulation"
      comment in all empty sections, the CA/Browser Forum is leaving
      such sections initially blank until a decision of "no stipulation"
      is made</blockquote>
    <br>
    In addition, section 2.2 states (emphasis added):<br>
    <br>
    <blockquote type="cite">The Certificate Policy and/or Certification
      Practice Statement MUST be structured in accordance with RFC 3647
      and <b>MUST include all material required by RFC 3647</b>.</blockquote>
    <br>
    If you go back to the discussions when the CA/B Forum decide to
    align with the "RFC 3647 format", we agreed to include each and
    every section of the outline as a minimum set.<br>
    <br>
    MRSP states in section 3.3 (5) (again, emphasis added):<br>
    <br>
    <blockquote type="cite">5. all CPs, CPSes, and combined CP/CPSes
      MUST be structured according to RFC 3647 and MUST:<br>
      <br>
          - include <b>at least every section and subsection defined in
        RFC 3647</b>;<br>
          - only use the words "No Stipulation" to mean that the
      particular document imposes no requirements related to that
      section; and<br>
          - contain no sections that are blank and have no subsections;</blockquote>
    <br>
    So, with all that considered, when we visit <a
      href="https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc3647#section-6">section
      6 of RFC 3647</a> ("the outline"), the expectation is to include
    each and every section and subsection of the outline (up to three
    levels).<br>
    <br>
    CAs are free to add MORE sections and subsections as they desire,
    just like the BRs have done, but we can't escape or "hijack" an
    existing RFC 3647 section number. The outline contains a specific
    section labeled as "3.2.1  Method to prove possession of private
    key". That means we cannot re-use the number 3.2.1 for something
    else.<br>
    <br>
    I hope this sounds reasonable to people.<br>
    <br>
    Dimitris.<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 1/12/2023 6:51 μ.μ., Tim Hollebeek
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:SN7PR14MB64924E142221A831ACBBC4878381A@SN7PR14MB6492.namprd14.prod.outlook.com">
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        <p class="MsoNormal">This is unfortunately wrong.  There are
          lots of misconceptions about RFC 3647 “compliance”.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">The first point is that RFC 3647 is an
          INFORMATIONAL RFC.  You can see this right at the top, where
          it says “Category: Informational”.  This means that it
          contains no requirements and it’s impossible to be out of
          compliance with it.  This is why I put quotes around
          “compliance”. Any requirements around it need to come from
          elsewhere, for example, a root program requirement that
          requires a particular document to be in RFC 3647 format.  But
          that’s vague and informal, because 3647 doesn’t have
          requirements, it just has an outline and suggested contents. 
          It’s not 100% precise what “MUST be in RFC 3647 format” means,
          and we need to just acknowledge that (specifying it precisely
          would be a colossal waste of time).<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">So what does “RFC 3647 format” mean?  RFC
          3647’s outline only covers the first two levels.  So “Section
          3.2: Initial Identity Validation” is a RFC 3647 section
          header, and most reasonable interpretations of “RFC 3647
          format” would require it to exist with that or a substantially
          similar name and contents.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Section 3.2.1, on the other hand, is not an
          RFC 3647 section.  It’s common to have a third level of
          headers that mirror the “bullet points” in the suggested
          content for the section, but those are just unordered bullet
          lists in RFC 3647.  Claiming that section 3.2.1 of a document
          in RFC 3647 must describe private key protection goes beyond
          what RFC 3647 says.  Section 3.2 just “contains the following
          elements”, so private key protection is just one of several
          topics that one might discuss in section 3.2.  It could be
          section 3.2.1, but it could be elsewhere in 3.2, and it’s
          perfectly fine for 3.2.1 to not exist, have different content,
          etc.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Figuring out where section 11.1 goes is not
          trivial, but at first glance, section 3.2 is not an
          unreasonable choice, and I can understand why Inigo made it. 
          And there isn’t a compliance reason why it can’t be section
          3.2.1, if that’s what we want.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Of course, we could convert the recommended
          bulleted sections to a numbered list of subsections (we often
          do elsewhere), in which case section 3.2.1 could be “Private
          Key Protection” with contents “No Stipulation”.  If we do
          that, I suggest we follow the rest of the bullets as well.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">Either way works.<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal">-Tim<o:p></o:p></p>
        <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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              <p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Dimitris Zacharopoulos
                <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:dzacharo@harica.gr"><dzacharo@harica.gr></a> <br>
                <b>Sent:</b> Friday, December 1, 2023 10:48 AM<br>
                <b>To:</b> Inigo Barreira
                <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com"><Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com></a><br>
                <b>Cc:</b> Tim Hollebeek
                <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:tim.hollebeek@digicert.com"><tim.hollebeek@digicert.com></a>; CA/B Forum Server
                Certificate WG Public Discussion List
                <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:servercert-wg@cabforum.org"><servercert-wg@cabforum.org></a><br>
                <b>Subject:</b> Re: [Servercert-wg] SC-065: Convert EVGs
                into RFC 3647 format pre-ballot<o:p></o:p></p>
            </div>
          </div>
          <p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
          <div>
            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">We MUST
                comply with RFC 3647 which means that we must include
                sections that are listed in the outline of 3647, and if
                we have nothing to say, we leave it empty. We can't
                "hijack" the numbering just because we have no
                requirements to describe. <br>
                <br>
                That's my interpretation of the RFC 3647 compliance.
                Perhaps others can chime in and state their opinion. <br>
                <br>
                <br>
                Thanks, <o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <p><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">DZ.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
          </div>
          <div>
            <div>
              <p><span style="font-family:"Arial",sans-serif">Dec
                  1, 2023 14:50:23 Inigo Barreira <<a
                    href="mailto:Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com"
                    moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext">Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com</a>>:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
            </div>
            <blockquote
style="border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 2.25pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 8.0pt;margin-left:0in;margin-right:0in">
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="ES">Thanks Dimitris.</span><span
                  style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">I think that
                  strictly speaking, in RFC 3647 this section is the
                  4.3.2 Initial Identity Validation and the first bullet
                  is about proving the possession of the private key,
                  but there´s no specific section other than the general
                  approach that we´ve implemented.</span><span
                  style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">That said, the
                  current EVG does not include anything about the
                  possession of the private key because that´s covered
                  in the TLS BRs so that section does not exist in the
                  EVGs and therefore I didn´t know how to
                  avoid/implement it.</span><span
                  style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">I decided to
                  continue with the normal numbering for an easy
                  checking, so all 11 section is moved into section 3.2
                  and the rest of the sub-numbers do not change (so 11.1
                  would be 3.2.1, 11.1.1 would be 3.2.1.1, etc.)</span><span
                  style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">I understand your
                  point but I think we can´t create a section 3.2.1 for
                  private key possession because there´s no such a text
                  in the EVGs (and don´t think we should add anything
                  new, even a NA for that) and don´t know which other
                  sections we can create under 3.2 that can break the
                  current equivalence, which again was done for an easy
                  comparison. </span><span
                  style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">So, what would you
                  suggest to “comply” with that? I don´t have a clear
                  idea.</span><span style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                  lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
              <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Regards</span><span
                  style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
              <div>
                <div
style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:KO" lang="ES">De:</span></b><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:KO" lang="ES">
                      Dimitris Zacharopoulos (HARICA) <<a
                        href="mailto:dzacharo@harica.gr"
                        moz-do-not-send="true"
                        class="moz-txt-link-freetext">dzacharo@harica.gr</a>>
                      <br>
                      <b>Enviado el:</b> jueves, 30 de noviembre de 2023
                      13:16<br>
                      <b>Para:</b> Inigo Barreira <<a
                        href="mailto:Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com"
                        moz-do-not-send="true"
                        class="moz-txt-link-freetext">Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com</a>>;
                      Tim Hollebeek <<a
                        href="mailto:tim.hollebeek@digicert.com"
                        moz-do-not-send="true"
                        class="moz-txt-link-freetext">tim.hollebeek@digicert.com</a>>;
                      CA/B Forum Server Certificate WG Public Discussion
                      List <<a
                        href="mailto:servercert-wg@cabforum.org"
                        moz-do-not-send="true"
                        class="moz-txt-link-freetext">servercert-wg@cabforum.org</a>><br>
                      <b>Asunto:</b> Re: [Servercert-wg] SC-065: Convert
                      EVGs into RFC 3647 format pre-ballot</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                </div>
              </div>
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style="border:solid black 1.0pt;padding:2.0pt 2.0pt 2.0pt 2.0pt">
                <p class="MsoNormal"
                  style="line-height:12.0pt;background:#FAFA03"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES">CAUTION:
                    This email originated from outside of the
                    organization. Do not click links or open attachments
                    unless you recognize the sender and know the content
                    is safe.</span><span style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                    lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
              </div>
              <div>
                <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
                    style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES">Inigo,<br>
                    <br>
                    As I am working to migrate the EV Guidelines into
                    the EV Code Signing Baseline Requirements I took a
                    look at the mapping you provided for the EV
                    Guidelines and noticed that you are proposing
                    migration of EVG section 11.1 into section 3.2.1.
                    This particular section is labeled "Method to prove
                    possession of private key" in RFC 3647 so I don't
                    think it is appropriate. I think it's best to create
                    new subsections under 3.2.<br>
                    <br>
                    Thanks,<br>
                    Dimitris.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES">On
                      8/9/2023 7:54 μ.μ., Inigo Barreira wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
                </div>
                <blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="ES">Hi all, </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="ES"> </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Attached
                      you´ll find the EVG v1.8.0 with comments in all
                      sections indicating where those sections, and the
                      content, have been moved into the new EVG RFC3647
                      format. So, with this document, plus the redlined
                      version, I hope you can have now a clearer view of
                      the changes done.</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Let me know if
                      you need anything else to clarify the new version.</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Regards</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <div>
                    <div
style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
                      <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES">De:</span></b><span
                          style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES">
                          Inigo Barreira <a
                            href="mailto:Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com"
                            moz-do-not-send="true"><Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com></a>
                          <br>
                          <b>Enviado el:</b> martes, 29 de agosto de
                          2023 17:06<br>
                          <b>Para:</b> Tim Hollebeek <a
                            href="mailto:tim.hollebeek@digicert.com"
                            moz-do-not-send="true"><tim.hollebeek@digicert.com></a>;
                          Dimitris Zacharopoulos (HARICA) <a
                            href="mailto:dzacharo@harica.gr"
                            moz-do-not-send="true"><dzacharo@harica.gr></a>;
                          CA/B Forum Server Certificate WG Public
                          Discussion List <a
                            href="mailto:servercert-wg@cabforum.org"
                            moz-do-not-send="true"><servercert-wg@cabforum.org></a><br>
                          <b>Asunto:</b> RE: [Servercert-wg] SC-065:
                          Convert EVGs into RFC 3647 format pre-ballot<o:p></o:p></span></p>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Thanks
                      Dimitris and Tim.</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">I did
                      something of that internally but didn´t reflect on
                      the document, so will try to reproduce to have it
                      clearer.</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">OTOH, and as
                      indicated in the PR, the whole section 11 has been
                      placed in section 3.2 keeping the rest of the
                      numbering. So, for example:</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">EVG                                    
                      EVG3647</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">11.1                                   
                      3.2.1</span><span style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                      lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">11.1.1                                
                      3.2.1.1</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">11.1.2                                
                      3.2.1.2</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">11.1.3                                
                      3.2.1.3</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">11.2                                   
                      3.2.2</span><span style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                      lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">11.2.1                                
                      3.2.2.1</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">…..                                      
                      ….           </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">11.13                                 
                      3.2.13</span><span style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                      lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">11.14                                 
                      3.2.14</span><span style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                      lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">11.14.1                              
                      3.2.14.1</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">11.14.2                              
                      3.2.14.2</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">11.14.3                              
                      3.2.14.3</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Hope this can
                      clarify the main difficult that I found in the
                      document, where to place it and how.</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB">Regards</span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <div>
                    <div
style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
                      <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="EN-GB">De:</span></b><span
                          style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="EN-GB">
                          Tim Hollebeek <<a
                            href="mailto:tim.hollebeek@digicert.com"
                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                            class="moz-txt-link-freetext">tim.hollebeek@digicert.com</a>>
                          <br>
                          <b>Enviado el:</b> martes, 29 de agosto de
                          2023 16:59<br>
                          <b>Para:</b> Dimitris Zacharopoulos (HARICA)
                          <<a href="mailto:dzacharo@harica.gr"
                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                            class="moz-txt-link-freetext">dzacharo@harica.gr</a>>;
                          Inigo Barreira <<a
                            href="mailto:Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com"
                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                            class="moz-txt-link-freetext">Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com</a>>;
                          CA/B Forum Server Certificate WG Public
                          Discussion List <<a
                            href="mailto:servercert-wg@cabforum.org"
                            moz-do-not-send="true"
                            class="moz-txt-link-freetext">servercert-wg@cabforum.org</a>><br>
                          <b>Asunto:</b> RE: [Servercert-wg] SC-065:
                          Convert EVGs into RFC 3647 format pre-ballot</span><span
                          style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <div
style="border:solid black 1.0pt;padding:2.0pt 2.0pt 2.0pt 2.0pt">
                    <p class="MsoNormal"
                      style="line-height:12.0pt;background:#FAFA03"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:JA">CAUTION:
                        This email originated from outside of the
                        organization. Do not click links or open
                        attachments unless you recognize the sender and
                        know the content is safe.</span><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  </div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman",serif;mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA">Yes, exactly.  I
                        would like to see a list that shows that
                        EVG-classic section 1.4 is now in EVG-3647
                        section 4.1.  Then I can look at where the new
                        text landed, see how the conversion was handled,
                        we can all verify that nothing was lost or left
                        out, etc.</span><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA">Without that,
                        anyone attempting to review the document is
                        forced to recreate the mapping just to figure
                        out where everything went and that nothing was
                        missed or put in the wrong place.  Redlines are
                        not sufficient when large amounts of text are
                        moving around to different places.</span><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA">I’m saying this
                        because from my spot-checking, the conversion
                        appears to be pretty good, and I’d like to be
                        able to do a final verification that it’s mostly
                        correct so I can endorse.</span><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA">-Tim</span><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                    <div
style="border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt">
                      <div>
                        <div
style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
                          <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA">From:</span></b><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> Dimitris
                              Zacharopoulos (HARICA) <</span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><a
                                href="mailto:dzacharo@harica.gr"
                                moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                  lang="EN-US">dzacharo@harica.gr</span></a></span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA">> <br>
                              <b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, August 29, 2023 7:58
                              AM<br>
                              <b>To:</b> Inigo Barreira <</span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><a
                                href="mailto:Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com"
                                moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                  lang="EN-US">Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com</span></a></span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA">>; CA/B
                              Forum Server Certificate WG Public
                              Discussion List <</span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><a
                                href="mailto:servercert-wg@cabforum.org"
                                moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                  lang="EN-US">servercert-wg@cabforum.org</span></a></span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA">>; Tim
                              Hollebeek <</span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><a
                                href="mailto:tim.hollebeek@digicert.com"
                                moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                  lang="EN-US">tim.hollebeek@digicert.com</span></a></span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA">><br>
                              <b>Subject:</b> Re: [Servercert-wg]
                              SC-065: Convert EVGs into RFC 3647 format
                              pre-ballot</span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                      <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                          style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                          style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                      <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
                          style="mso-fareast-language:JA">Hi Inigo,<br>
                          <br>
                          You can take some guidance from previous
                          successful efforts to convert existing
                          documents into RFC 3647 format. The latest
                          attempt was in the Code Signing BRs conversion
                          in May 2022. Check out the mapping document
                          and the comments in the </span><span
                          style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><a
href="https://lists.cabforum.org/pipermail/cscwg-public/2022-May/000795.html"
                            moz-do-not-send="true"><span lang="EN-US">ballot
                              discussion period</span></a></span><span
                          style="mso-fareast-language:JA">.<br>
                          <br>
                          For each existing section/paragraph, it would
                          be nice to have a comment describing where
                          that existing language will land in the
                          converted document (destination). This will
                          allow all existing text to be accounted for.<br>
                          <br>
                          During this process, you might encounter
                          duplicate or redundant text which needs to be
                          flagged accordingly. You might also get into
                          some uncertainty as to which RFC3647 section
                          is a best fit for existing text that might
                          require additional discussion. <br>
                          <br>
                          I hope this helps.<br>
                          <br>
                          <br>
                          Dimitris.</span><span
                          style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                      <div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA">On 29/8/2023
                            12:42 μ.μ., Inigo Barreira via Servercert-wg
                            wrote:</span><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                      </div>
                      <blockquote
                        style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="EN-GB">Hi
                            Tim,</span><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="EN-GB">See
                            attached redlined and current versions. I
                            just used what Martijn suggested yesterday
                            but let me know if this is what you were
                            looking for.</span><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="EN-GB">Regards</span><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="EN-GB"> </span><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                        <div>
                          <div
style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                                  style="mso-fareast-language:JA">De:</span></b><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> Tim
                                Hollebeek </span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><a
href="mailto:tim.hollebeek@digicert.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                    lang="EN-US"><tim.hollebeek@digicert.com></span></a></span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> <br>
                                <b>Enviado el:</b> lunes, 28 de agosto
                                de 2023 19:49<br>
                                <b>Para:</b> Inigo Barreira </span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><a
href="mailto:Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                    lang="EN-US"><Inigo.Barreira@sectigo.com></span></a></span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA">; CA/B
                                Forum Server Certificate WG Public
                                Discussion List </span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><a
href="mailto:servercert-wg@cabforum.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                    lang="EN-US"><servercert-wg@cabforum.org></span></a></span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"><br>
                                <b>Asunto:</b> RE: SC-065: Convert EVGs
                                into RFC 3647 format pre-ballot</span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                        <div
style="border:solid black 1.0pt;padding:2.0pt 2.0pt 2.0pt 2.0pt">
                          <p class="MsoNormal"
style="line-height:12.0pt;background:#FAFA03"><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;color:black;mso-fareast-language:JA">CAUTION:
                              This email originated from outside of the
                              organization. Do not click links or open
                              attachments unless you recognize the
                              sender and know the content is safe.</span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                        </div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA">Thanks for
                              doing this Inigo … I know re-organizations
                              like this are a lot of work and fall very
                              much in the category of “important but not
                              fun”.  So thanks for taking an initial
                              stab at this.</span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA">Is there a
                              mapping that shows where all the original
                              text ended up?  I think that’s going to be
                              essential for people to be able to review
                              this.  I did some spot checking, and your
                              conversion looks pretty good, but I wasn’t
                              able to do a more detailed review without
                              a mapping.</span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA">-Tim</span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                          <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                              style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                          <div
style="border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt">
                            <div>
                              <div
style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                                      style="mso-fareast-language:JA">From:</span></b><span
                                    style="mso-fareast-language:JA">
                                    Servercert-wg <</span><span
                                    style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                    lang="ES"><a
href="mailto:servercert-wg-bounces@cabforum.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                        lang="EN-US">servercert-wg-bounces@cabforum.org</span></a></span><span
                                    style="mso-fareast-language:JA">>
                                    <b>On Behalf Of </b>Inigo Barreira
                                    via Servercert-wg<br>
                                    <b>Sent:</b> Monday, August 28, 2023
                                    5:20 AM<br>
                                    <b>To:</b> CA/B Forum Server
                                    Certificate WG Public Discussion
                                    List <</span><span
                                    style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                    lang="ES"><a
href="mailto:servercert-wg@cabforum.org" moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                        lang="EN-US">servercert-wg@cabforum.org</span></a></span><span
                                    style="mso-fareast-language:JA">><br>
                                    <b>Subject:</b> [Servercert-wg]
                                    SC-065: Convert EVGs into RFC 3647
                                    format pre-ballot</span><span
                                    style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                    lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                              </div>
                            </div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA">Hello,</span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA">The
                                current Extended Validation Guidelines
                                (EVGs) are written in a non-standardized
                                format. For many years it has been
                                discussed to convert this document into
                                the RFC 3647 format and follow the
                                standardized model for this type of
                                documents. </span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA">Given
                                that this has been known for several
                                years, I have prepared the following
                                ballot text, which converts the EVGs
                                into the RFC 3647 format:</span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><a
href="https://url.avanan.click/v2/___https:/github.com/cabforum/servercert/pull/440___.YXAzOmRpZ2ljZXJ0OmE6bzoyOGIxNWVhZGVmZDlkZTM0NjQzZTA3YTlmYTA2MzM5YTo2OmExZWM6NGZmMGEzM2U0ZWZjOTU4MTM1NWRkNjU3ZDE5YjU3Y2YxNzg1NWU0ZTVjYzkzY2NjM2M0MWU5MzEyYzJmZTQ0NzpoOkY"
title="Protected by Avanan: https://github.com/cabforum/servercert/pull/440"
                                  moz-do-not-send="true"><span
                                    lang="EN-GB">EVGs based on RFC3647
                                    by barrini · Pull Request #440 ·
                                    cabforum/servercert (github.com)</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA">I am
                                currently seeking two endorsers as well
                                as any feedback on the ballot content
                                itself (wording, effective dates, etc.).</span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA">Thanks,</span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                                style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                                lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                          </div>
                        </div>
                        <p class="MsoNormal"
                          style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                            style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
                        <pre><span style="mso-fareast-language:JA">_______________________________________________</span><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
                        <pre><span style="mso-fareast-language:JA">Servercert-wg mailing list</span><span
                        style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
                        <pre><span style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                        lang="ES"><a
                        href="mailto:Servercert-wg@cabforum.org"
                        moz-do-not-send="true"><span lang="EN-US">Servercert-wg@cabforum.org</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
                        <pre><span style="mso-fareast-language:JA"
                        lang="ES"><a
href="https://lists.cabforum.org/mailman/listinfo/servercert-wg"
                        moz-do-not-send="true"><span lang="EN-US">https://lists.cabforum.org/mailman/listinfo/servercert-wg</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></pre>
                      </blockquote>
                      <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                          style="mso-fareast-language:JA"> </span><span
                          style="mso-fareast-language:JA" lang="ES"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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