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We made some progress and we're getting closer to starting the
discussion period for this ballot. We're "almost" there :)<br>
<br>
I have created a pull request
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://github.com/dzacharo/documents/pull/2">https://github.com/dzacharo/documents/pull/2</a> that contains all the
changes we discussed in past meetings. We have two (final?) issues
to address before proceeding:<br>
<ol>
<li>Ryan suggested that we replace the term "Full Member" (new
term I proposed) with "Voting Member". I support this change
which makes things clearer to the readers. "Members" would be
the total of "Voting Members, Associate Members and Interested
Parties".</li>
<li>We added the term "Voting Representative". My suggestion was
to leave "the <b>process </b>to designate Voting
Representatives for voting members" to the individual Chartered
Working Group charters to address. Google strongly feels the
assignment process should be addressed and described in the
Bylaws and be Forum-level consistent. I don't have strong
feelings about this and would be happy to make this process
Forum-wide.<br>
</li>
</ol>
<p>I would like to hear any feedback with objections or concerns
regarding these two changes. Unless I hear otherwise, I will
proceed with these updates on Friday April 24. Hopefully, if I get
a second endorser we can start the discussion period on April 27.
As promised, the discussion will remain open for at least 14 days
before considering voting to begin.</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>Thank you,<br>
</p>
Dimitris.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2020-02-29 12:07 π.μ., Dimitris
Zacharopoulos (HARICA) via Public wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:47829a57-af6a-942b-46c2-75ea532ef60b@harica.gr">
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<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 2020-02-28 5:29 μ.μ., Ryan Sleevi
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CACvaWvbyHxChrCy9m1-kKXAzdANok84obmRSbcO6m22T50rSww@mail.gmail.com">
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<div dir="ltr">
<div>Hi Dimitris,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>There's a lot of changes here, and this will take us
quite a bit of time to digest.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I don't know that we're necessarily supportive of the
"Full Member" definition, and the implications that has. The
implicit consequences of treating Interested Parties as
Members of the Forum is not what was intended with the
current Bylaws, as I understand it, and so it has
ramifications throughout. That is, our definitions have
historically been "Member, Associate Member, Interested
Party" - with zero overlap. This seems to redefine things to
be "Full Member, Associate Member, Interested Party", with
using "Member" as the aggregate term for all three, and it's
unclear why that was necessary.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
The concern that was documented in the Bylaws issues was that it
becomes confusing when we use plural (i.e. Forum Members, WG
Members). Does that include "all Members"? Does it include only
"Members" (with a capital "M")? Does it include every Forum
member? That's mainly the problem I tried to solve by adding the
"Full Member" definition. However, if we can find an alternative
approach to achieve the same goal, I would support it.<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CACvaWvbyHxChrCy9m1-kKXAzdANok84obmRSbcO6m22T50rSww@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>However, the biggest concern remains with the approach to
the Chair / Vice Chair making changes to "Informative"
sections. We're tremendously appreciative of your efforts
here in finding a solution, and we're trying to work through
how best to propose changes that capture the intent. We're
very appreciative of the explicit attempt to limit the scope
in sucha manner.</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Thank you for that, all I did was include some language that was
proposed in previous meeting. I hope it will only require a few
more tweaks to become acceptable by Google.<br>
<br>
Dimitris.<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CACvaWvbyHxChrCy9m1-kKXAzdANok84obmRSbcO6m22T50rSww@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="ltr"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Feb 28, 2020 at
6:15 AM Dimitris Zacharopoulos (HARICA) via Public <<a
href="mailto:public@cabforum.org" moz-do-not-send="true">public@cabforum.org</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div> <br>
<br>
I just received a comment that Section 2.3 point 7 also
needs to precede all occurrences of "Member" with
"Full", as Interested Parties are sometimes able to
participate in Forum Teleconferences, etc, and so may
affect the quorum without a corresponding ability to
vote.<br>
<br>
So, I updated this paragraph to:<br>
<br>
"7. A ballot result will be considered valid only
when more than half of the number of currently active <font
color="#ff0000">Full </font>Members has participated.
The number of currently active Full Members is the
average number of <font color="#ff0000">Full </font>Member
organizations that have participated in the previous
three (3) Forum Meetings and Forum Teleconferences."<br>
<br>
There is no need to circulate a new version yet. I'll
wait for more feedback.<br>
<br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
Dimitris.<br>
<br>
<div>On 2020-02-27 8:51 μ.μ., Dimitris Zacharopoulos
(HARICA) via Public wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"> Following up from the latest
F2F meeting, I have prepared a ballot for a Bylaws
update. <br>
<br>
I am looking for two endorsers.<br>
<br>
Thanks,<br>
Dimitris.<br>
<br>
<br>
<b>Purpose of Ballot:</b> The Forum has identified and
discussed a number of improvements to be made to the
current version of the Bylaws to improve clarity and
allow the Forum to function more effectively. Most of
these changes are described in the “I<a
href="https://docs.google.com/document/d/1EtrIy3F5cPge0_M-C8J6fe72KcVI8H5Q_2S6S31ynU0"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">ssues with
Bylaws to be addressed</a>” document.<br>
<br>
Here is a list of major changes:<br>
<ol>
<li>Clarification of the use of the term “Member” so
it is clear when we discuss about all Forum
Members (which includes Associate Members and
Interested Parties), and when we discuss about the
“Full Members”. <br>
</li>
<li>Adding the term “Voting Representative” which is
designated by each Member. Only votes submitted by
Voting Representatives will be considered</li>
<li>Replacing of the term “Forum wiki” with the
properly defined term “Member Web Site”</li>
<li>Removing references for Webmaster in the
definition of “Public Web Site” since it is
repeated in section 5.2</li>
<li>New Photography Policy in Exhibit D</li>
<li>Clarification of 4.1 (2) that Forum Members
nominate representatives</li>
<li>Allowing informative changes to Guidelines by
the Chair or Vice Chair<br>
</li>
<li>In 5.3.1 require that a Certificate Issuer is
trusted in the “latest” software produced by a
Certificate Consumer</li>
</ol>
<b>— MOTION BEGINS –</b><br>
<br>
<b>Amendment to the Bylaws:</b> Replace the entire
text of the Bylaws of the CA/Browser Forum with the
attached version (CA-Browser Forum Bylaws draft
v2.3.pdf).<br>
<br>
<b><br>
</b><b>— MOTION ENDS –</b><br>
<br>
A red-line is also attached (CA-Browser Forum Bylaws
draft v2.3 redline.pdf).<br>
<br>
<p>The procedure for approval of this ballot is as
follows:</p>
<p>Formal discussion period: (14+ days)</p>
<p>Ballot Discussion Begins: March XX, 2020 19:00 UTC</p>
<p>Ballot Discussion Ends: March XX, 2020 19:00 UTC</p>
<div>
<p>Vote for approval (7 days)</p>
<p>Ballot Vote Begins: TBD</p>
<p>Ballot Vote Ends: TBD</p>
</div>
<br>
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