<div dir="ltr">Right, my goal in raising this issue was to make sure that there's a consistent understanding - between Subscribers, Root Stores, Relying Parties, and CAs - as to what Misuse is.<div><br></div><div>The proposal in the meeting had been "Treat misuse as defined in the CA's CP/CPS", and the question that came from that was whether or not that requirement was already captured in our existing reasons for revocation.</div><div><br></div><div>It sounds like there's a thin sliver that is distinct - since our Subscriber Agreement/TOU requirements don't actually require that the Subscriber use it in the CP/CPS-dictated way - so we can alternatively word that requirement as:</div><div><br></div><div>4.9.1.1 (currently)</div><div>"4. The CA obtains evidence that the Certificate was misused;"<br></div><div><br></div><div>4.9.1.1 (future)</div><div>"4. The CA obtains evidence that the Certificate was misused, as defined by Section 1.4.1 and 1.4.2 of the CA's CP/CPS;"<br></div><div><br></div><div>This makes it clear what misuse is, and where CAs should specify what misuse is.</div><div><br></div><div>Similarly, we'd want to make sure that the Agreement/TOU was also updated to reflect what "misuse" is to more accurately capture it, namely</div><div>9.6.3 (future)</div><div>"8. Acknowledgment and Acceptance: An acknowledgment and acceptance that the CA is entitled to revoke the certificate immediately if the Applicant were to violate the terms of the Subscriber Agreement or Terms of Use or if the CA is required to revoke the certificate for one of the reasons described in Section 4.9.1.1"</div><div><br></div><div>That above change would cover all CA-initiated revocation indemnification, which CAs should appreciate.</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Jun 8, 2018 at 6:31 AM, Adriano Santoni via Public <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:public@cabforum.org" target="_blank">public@cabforum.org</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
  
    
  
  <div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
    <p><font face="Calibri">IMO, a CA can describe in their CPS what
        "misuse" is, and the BRs should allow CAs to revoke certificates
        that are "misused" according to their respective CPSes. The CPS
        is a contract, in essence, and it's up to the Applicant to
        decide whether they like it or not. If a CPS provides for
        revocation of the SSL certificate in case it is used on a web
        site that (just for example, I am not suggesting anything to
        anyone) sells weapons ... the Applicant may not say they did not
        know, and I do not think that this need to be expressly covered
        in the BR (nor should it be forbidden).</font><br>
    </p><div><div class="h5">
    <br>
    <div class="m_-9157181830328910296moz-cite-prefix">Il 08/06/2018 11:52, Ryan Sleevi via
      Public ha scritto:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">I'm not sure. Misuse defines what it's not, while
        allowing for a whole host of things which it is. If it's defined
        as the antonym, and we defined that particular function or use,
        then that would forbid any uses not covered - probably not what
        is intended.</div>
      <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Jun 8, 2018 at 5:36 AM,
          Moudrick M. Dadashov via Public <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:public@cabforum.org" target="_blank">public@cabforum.org</a>></span>
          wrote:<br>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Would it
            help if we define its antonym e.g. "designed for or capable
            of a particular function or use"?<br>
            <br>
            Thanks,<br>
            M.D.
            <div>
              <div class="m_-9157181830328910296h5"><br>
                <br>
                <br>
                On 2018-06-07 17:32, Ryan Sleevi via Public wrote:<br>
              </div>
            </div>
            <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
              <div>
                <div class="m_-9157181830328910296h5">
                  On Thu, Jun 7, 2018 at 10:24 AM, Geoff Keating <<a href="mailto:geoffk@apple.com" target="_blank">geoffk@apple.com</a>><br>
                  wrote:<br>
                  <br>
                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                      On Jun 7, 2018, at 1:40 PM, Ryan Sleevi via Public<br>
                    </blockquote>
                    <<a href="mailto:public@cabforum.org" target="_blank">public@cabforum.org</a>>
                    wrote:<br>
                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                      <br>
                      In the pursuit of a definition, we tried to work
                      backwards - what<br>
                    </blockquote>
                    are situations we think are misuse.<br>
                    <br>
                    The dictionary definition of ‘misuse’ is:<br>
                    <br>
                    use (something) in the wrong way or for the wrong
                    purpose<br>
                  </blockquote>
                  <br>
                  I'm not sure how this helps us move forward - were you
                  suggesting that<br>
                  4.9.1.1 would read:<br>
                  <br>
                  4. The CA obtains evidence that the Certificate was
                  used for the wrong<br>
                  way or for the wrong purpose;<br>
                  <br>
                  With such a definition, this supposes there's a right
                  way or right<br>
                  purpose.<br>
                  <br>
                  1) Do you believe the right purpose is wholly
                  reflecting in the<br>
                  Subscriber Agreement or Terms of Use?<br>
                  2) Do you believe the right way is wholly reflected in
                  the definition<br>
                  I provided (from 1.1), that the right way is "used for
                  authenticating<br>
                  servers accessible through the Internet"<br>
                   <br>
                  <br>
                  <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                      Another suggestion was that it involved scenarios
                      where the<br>
                    </blockquote>
                    Subscriber private key was in an HSM, and itself was
                    not<br>
                    compromised, but had signed things it was not
                    expected to. This<br>
                    wasn't elaborated on further - so I'm uncertain if
                    this meant things<br>
                    other than the TLS handshake transcript - but this
                    is already met by<br>
                    our definition of Key Compromise in 1.6.1, that is:<br>
                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                      ""A Private Key is said to be compromised if its
                      value has been<br>
                    </blockquote>
                    disclosed to an<br>
                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                          unauthorized person, an unauthorized person
                      has had access<br>
                    </blockquote>
                    to it, or there exists a<br>
                    <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                          practical technique by which an unauthorized
                      person may<br>
                    </blockquote>
                    discover its value. “""<br>
                    <br>
                    If a key is in a HSM and not exportable, then its
                    value is not<br>
                    disclosed, nor does an unauthorized person have
                    access *to the<br>
                    key*.  Dictionary definition of ‘access’ is 'obtain,
                    examine,<br>
                    or retrieve’ none of which apply here.  So it is not
                    covered by<br>
                    Key Compromise.<br>
                  </blockquote>
                  <br>
                  I'm not sure - what are you providing an example of? I
                  would think<br>
                  that, say, generating a signed message that was not
                  authorized, then<br>
                  "an unauthorized person has access to it". Perhaps you
                  could help me<br>
                  understand this misuse - is it that the signature was
                  authorized and<br>
                  was directed to sign something that they didn't want
                  to do?<br>
                </div>
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