<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class="">I can’t see that being the reason as Ukraine was a part of the Soviet Union at the time and the UK was and is a member of the UN security council.<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Mar 20, 2017, at 6:36 AM, Rob Stradling <<a href="mailto:rob.stradling@comodo.com" class="">rob.stradling@comodo.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">Here's a different theory...</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><a href="http://forum.geonames.org/gforum/posts/list/58.page#203" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">http://forum.geonames.org/gforum/posts/list/58.page#203</a><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">'However, the United Kingdom and the Ukraine both wanted "UK" so rather</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">than start World War III over the matter, the United Kingdom was</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">assigned "GB" and the Ukraine was assigned "UA."'</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">On 19/03/17 17:50, philliph--- via Public wrote:</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><blockquote type="cite" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">The Web Site does not tell the truth of the matter. The reason the codes<br class="">were created in the first place was for the car codes and HMG didn’t<br class="">want people vandalizing cars because they had UK on them.<br class=""><br class="">The reason I know is that my cousin was minister for Transport and I<br class="">asked him.<br class=""><br class="">This is the ex-post-facto rationalization because the real reason could<br class="">not be given.<br class=""><br class=""><br class=""><br class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class="">On Mar 17, 2017, at 7:57 PM, Peter Bowen via Public<br class=""><<a href="mailto:public@cabforum.org" class="">public@cabforum.org</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><<a href="mailto:public@cabforum.org" class="">mailto:public@cabforum.org</a>>> wrote:<br class=""><br class="">Kirk,<br class=""><br class="">ISO 3166 was apparently created in 1974 to provide a distinct two<br class="">letter code for each country. From their own FAQ<br class="">(<a href="https://web.archive.org/web/20120616044022/http://www.iso.org/iso/country_codes/iso_3166-faqs/iso_3166_faqs_specific.htm" class="">https://web.archive.org/web/20120616044022/http://www.iso.org/iso/country_codes/iso_3166-faqs/iso_3166_faqs_specific.htm</a>):<br class=""><br class=""><br class=""> Why is the United Kingdom (of Great Britain and Northern<br class=""> Ireland) coded GB in ISO 3166-1?<br class=""><br class=""><br class="">The codes in ISO 3166-1 are - wherever possible - chosen to reflect<br class="">the significant, unique component of the country name in order to<br class="">allow a visual association between country name and country code.<br class="">Since name components<br class="">like /Republic/, /Kingdom/, /United/, /Federal /or /Democratic /are<br class="">used very often in country names we usually do not derive the country<br class="">code elements from them in order to avoid ambiguity. The name<br class="">components /United /and /Kingdom/ are not appropriate for ISO 3166-1.<br class="">Therefore the code "GB" was created from Great Britain and not "UK"<br class="">for United Kingdom. Incidently, GB is also the United<br class="">Kingdom's /international road vehicle distinguishing sign/ - the code<br class="">on the oval nationality stickers on cars.<br class=""><br class="">Given that neither the EU or Greece has requested EL to be reserved<br class="">for any purpose (<a href="https://www.iso.org/obp/ui/#iso:code:3166:EL" class="">https://www.iso.org/obp/ui/#iso:code:3166:EL</a>) I don’t<br class="">believe it makes sense to use this in the country code field.<br class=""><br class="">Thanks,<br class="">Peter<br class=""><br class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class="">On Mar 17, 2017, at 3:55 PM, Kirk Hall via Public<br class=""><<a href="mailto:public@cabforum.org" class="">public@cabforum.org</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><<a href="mailto:public@cabforum.org" class="">mailto:public@cabforum.org</a>>> wrote:<br class=""><br class="">Ryan makes a good point – where there is a conflict between local law<br class="">or practice (or desired practice) and the BRs, the best first step is<br class="">to amend the BRs to allow compliance with local law or practice (or<br class="">desired practice).<br class=""><br class="">As I recall the country codes we are all stuck with were created in<br class="">the 1960s for a purpose unrelated to SSL and digital certificates.<br class="">There must have been a good reason for representing the United<br class="">Kingdom (England, Wales, Scotland (for now), and Northern Ireland) as<br class="">“GB” when Northern Island (part of the UK) is not in Great Britain<br class="">and UK is the more generally known acronym for the United Kingdom –<br class="">but I can’t imagine what the good reason was.<br class=""><br class="">Instead of a ballot that presents a sweeping new structure for<br class="">country names, or points to another new document, maybe we just<br class="">create an Appendix to the BRs that allows different country codes for<br class="">Greece and the United Kingdom (as an alternative). We would endorse<br class="">such a ballot.<br class=""><br class="">*From:* Public [<a href="mailto:public-bounces@cabforum.org" class="">mailto:public-bounces@cabforum.org</a>] *On Behalf<br class="">Of *Ryan Sleevi via Public<br class="">*Sent:* Friday, March 17, 2017 1:12 PM<br class="">*To:* Dimitris Zacharopoulos <<a href="mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr" class="">jimmy@it.auth.gr</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><<a href="mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr" class="">mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr</a>>><br class="">*Cc:* Ryan Sleevi <<a href="mailto:sleevi@google.com" class="">sleevi@google.com</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><<a href="mailto:sleevi@google.com" class="">mailto:sleevi@google.com</a>>>;<br class="">CA/Browser Forum Public Discussion List <<a href="mailto:public@cabforum.org" class="">public@cabforum.org</a><br class=""><<a href="mailto:public@cabforum.org" class="">mailto:public@cabforum.org</a>>><br class="">*Subject:* Re: [cabfpub] C=GR, C=UK exceptions in BRs<br class=""><br class=""><br class=""><br class="">On Fri, Mar 17, 2017 at 4:08 PM, Ryan Sleevi <<a href="mailto:sleevi@google.com" class="">sleevi@google.com</a><br class=""><<a href="mailto:sleevi@google.com" class="">mailto:sleevi@google.com</a>>> wrote:<br class=""><br class=""> On Fri, Mar 17, 2017 at 3:01 PM, Dimitris Zacharopoulos<br class=""> <<a href="mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr" class="">jimmy@it.auth.gr</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><<a href="mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr" class="">mailto:jimmy@it.auth.gr</a>>> wrote:<br class=""><br class=""> The "spirit" of 9.16.3 is also to bring conflicting<br class=""> requirements to the CA/B Forum to consider possible revisions<br class=""> accordingly. This is exactly what I am doing, without<br class=""> violating the current BRs, but hoping that the CA/B Forum<br class=""> will read this as a conflicting requirement which could be<br class=""> resolved by adding a simple exception, without creating any<br class=""> risk in current practices.<br class=""><br class=""><br class="">For what it's worth - I agree with this sentiment, and it's worth<br class="">considering, separate of 9.16.3, whether to _revise_ the BRs to<br class="">accomodate this case. Such revisions must account for ambiguity. In<br class="">many ways, the BRs strive to eliminate the rampant ambiguity that<br class="">existed due to CAs' various practices, as a whole (since no two CAs<br class="">really have the same CP/CPS), and so we should strive, as much as<br class="">possible, to unambiguously represent the information that members see<br class="">as valuable.<br class=""><br class="">Of course, it might be that identity information in certificates is<br class="">not valuable, precisely because of ambiguities and conflicts that<br class="">naturally emerge from CAs. In that case, it might be worthwhile to<br class="">simply stop trying to represent identity information within<br class="">certificates, and accept that ambiguity, rather than try to carve it<br class="">up. However, since the Forum values identity information at present,<br class="">it makes sense to opt for strictness as much as possible, or to<br class="">explicitly describe the deviations permitted and assess their risk,<br class="">as you propose doing and is worth at least discussing :)<br class=""></blockquote></blockquote></blockquote><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">--<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">Rob Stradling</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">Senior Research & Development Scientist</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 18px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">COMODO - Creating Trust Online</span></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></div></div></body></html>