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If the calls are already recorded, do you have recordings from past
calls for which minutes were not produced? If yes, can those
minutes be produced? As Ryan points out, this may well be relevant
to IPR claims.<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 11/7/2016 11:45 AM, Jeremy Rowley
via Public wrote:<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">The
calls are recorded already. I simply failed to circulate
minutes about half the time. I’ll make sure they are
circulated promptly going forward.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a moz-do-not-send="true"
name="_MailEndCompose"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif"><o:p> </o:p></span></a></p>
<span style="mso-bookmark:_MailEndCompose"></span>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
Public [<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:public-bounces@cabforum.org">mailto:public-bounces@cabforum.org</a>] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Dean Coclin via Public<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, November 7, 2016 10:43 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> CA/Browser Forum Public Discussion List
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:public@cabforum.org"><public@cabforum.org></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Dean Coclin <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:Dean_Coclin@symantec.com"><Dean_Coclin@symantec.com></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [cabfpub] Validation WG<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">It’s
an easy change to setup these calls to be recorded, however,
it’s up to the chair of that group to agree to such change
and subsequently making that recording public. <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I
don’t think conducting all WG business on the list is
productive or efficient and it would have likely taken
longer than 1.5 years to come up with ballot 169 if it was
done that way.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D">I’m
sure the group can either decide to record or have an
electronic transcription if the concerns noted below are
deemed significant.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif">
Public [<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:public-bounces@cabforum.org">mailto:public-bounces@cabforum.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Ryan Sleevi via Public<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, November 07, 2016 12:07 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> CA/Browser Forum Public Discussion List <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:public@cabforum.org">public@cabforum.org</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Ryan Sleevi <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:sleevi@google.com">sleevi@google.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [cabfpub] Validation WG<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Jeremy,<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Just to check - I don't recall there
being a formal ballot to terminate the WG (as per section
5.2 of the bylaws), so a few quick and easy process
questions:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">1) Do you expect that the continuation
of the Validation WG will be conducted in accordance with
the scope and deliverables of Ballot 143 ( <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://cabforum.org/2015/02/18/ballot-143-formalization-validation-working-group/">https://cabforum.org/2015/02/18/ballot-143-formalization-validation-working-group/</a>
), which established the Validation WG?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">2) Do you intend to propose a Ballot to
terminate the Validation WG upon the completion of some
deliverable?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Considering that the Validation WG will
be having phone meetings, for the sake of members'
protection with respect to our IPR policy, and the fact
that Participants Contributions cannot be Excluded from
the RF license if incorporated into a FG/FMG and were
recorded in the minutes as such, does the Validation WG
intend to adhere to (a) and (b) of Section 5.2, namely:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">(a) Draft and final agendas for Working
Group meetings, Forum Meetings and Forum Teleconferences
(including any sub-groups or committees).<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">(b) Final minutes of Forum Meetings and
Forum Teleconferences (including minutes of any sub-groups
or committees), and minutes of all Working Group
teleconferences and meetings. <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Given the potential sensitivities, I
think we would be more inclined to propose a ballot to
terminate the Validation WG unless we can receive
assurances that the bylaws' process will be followed with
respect to minutes, such that we can accurately and
completely track the provenance of any proposals put
forward by the members of the Validation WG, given that,
to date, it seems matters within the Validation WG have
been the only ones which have triggered Exclusion Notices.
Given this, the Validation WG should take appropriate
precautions to ensure that calls are recorded, minutes are
complete and accurate, and no suggestions are incorporated
into any ballots without the ability to track who
contributed what, and when.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Alternatively, conducting all matters
on the list, without any phone calls, would be sufficient
to ensure that all members Contributions are reflected as
such, as per 8.3 (c) of our IPR policy:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">c. “Contribution” means material,
including Draft Guidelines, Draft Guideline text, and
modifications to other Contributions, made verbally or in
a tangible form of expression (including in electronic
media) which is provided by a Participant in the process
of developing a Draft Guideline for the purpose of
incorporating such material into a Draft Guideline or a
Final Guideline or Final Maintenance Guideline. For a
verbal contribution to be deemed a Contribution hereunder
it must be memorialized within approved meeting minutes of
the CAB Forum.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, Nov 7, 2016 at 8:46 AM, Jeremy
Rowley via Public <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:public@cabforum.org" target="_blank">public@cabforum.org</a>>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">During
the face-to-face we discussed restarting the
validation working group. Please let me know if you
are interested and the agenda items you’d like to
discuss. We plan on starting the meetings at the
time slot previously occupied by the code signing
working group (9 Pacific). <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto"> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"
style="mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto">Jeremy<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
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