<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40">
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=us-ascii">
<meta name="Generator" content="Microsoft Word 15 (filtered medium)">
<!--[if !mso]><style>v\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
o\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
w\:* {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
.shape {behavior:url(#default#VML);}
</style><![endif]--><style><!--
/* Font Definitions */
@font-face
{font-family:"Cambria Math";
panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:DengXian;
panose-1:2 1 6 0 3 1 1 1 1 1;}
@font-face
{font-family:Calibri;
panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}
@font-face
{font-family:"\@DengXian";
panose-1:2 1 6 0 3 1 1 1 1 1;}
/* Style Definitions */
p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
{margin:0in;
font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
{mso-style-priority:99;
color:#0563C1;
text-decoration:underline;}
p.MsoPlainText, li.MsoPlainText, div.MsoPlainText
{mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"Plain Text Char";
margin:0in;
font-size:11.0pt;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
span.PlainTextChar
{mso-style-name:"Plain Text Char";
mso-style-priority:99;
mso-style-link:"Plain Text";
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;}
span.EmailStyle22
{mso-style-type:personal-reply;
font-family:"Calibri",sans-serif;
color:windowtext;}
.MsoChpDefault
{mso-style-type:export-only;
font-size:10.0pt;}
@page WordSection1
{size:8.5in 11.0in;
margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}
div.WordSection1
{page:WordSection1;}
--></style><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapedefaults v:ext="edit" spidmax="1026" />
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
<o:shapelayout v:ext="edit">
<o:idmap v:ext="edit" data="1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]-->
</head>
<body lang="EN-US" link="#0563C1" vlink="#954F72" style="word-wrap:break-word">
<div class="WordSection1">
<p class="MsoNormal">Here is a response from Oracle regarding invalidity date and timestamping. I thought I would circulate to ensure that I didn’t mis-interpret.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks, Bruce.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Raji Madduri <raji.madduri@oracle.com> <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, January 27, 2022 4:47 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Bruce Morton <Bruce.Morton@entrust.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> javase-ca-request_ww_grp <javase-ca-request_ww_grp@oracle.com><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] RE: Invalidity Date<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">WARNING: This email originated outside of Entrust.<br>
DO NOT CLICK links or attachments unless you trust the sender and know the content is safe.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center">
<hr size="2" width="100%" align="center">
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Bruce,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">In response to your question:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="background:yellow;mso-highlight:yellow">Is this also true if the certificate has expired? What I mean is that if the certificate expired, the signature would not be trusted, even if it was time-stamped.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">This is not true. Assuming the signature of the signed and timestamped JAR is still valid then an expired code signing certificate is still valid as long as the timestamp is within the certificate validity period of all certificates
in the signer's chain.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">However, if the timestamp or TSA certificate (or any certificates in its<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">chain) is expired, revoked, or otherwise invalid, then the signed code is treated as if it were not timestamped. In this case, if the signer's certificate had also expired, then it would be treated as invalid.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">Before deploying timestamped code, customers should always run "jarsigner -verify" to confirm that the code is properly timestamped. If there is something wrong with the timestamp, jarsigner should print out the following warning:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">"This jar contains signatures that do not include a timestamp. Without a timestamp, users may not be able to validate this jar after any of the signer certificates expire (as early as %1$tY-%1$tm-%1$td)."<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">Running jarsigner again with "-J-Djava.security.debug=jar" should print out information about why the timestamp was invalid.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">To check if certificates are revoked, you can add the "-revCheck" option to jarsigner (since JDK 15).<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Hope this helps. Let us know if you need any further clarification.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Raji<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Bruce Morton <<a href="mailto:Bruce.Morton@entrust.com">Bruce.Morton@entrust.com</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, December 3, 2021 8:54 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Raji Madduri <<a href="mailto:raji.madduri@oracle.com">raji.madduri@oracle.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> javase-ca-request_ww_grp <<a href="mailto:javase-ca-request_ww_grp@oracle.com">javase-ca-request_ww_grp@oracle.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [External] : RE: Invalidity Date<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Raji,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Is this also true if the certificate has expired? What I mean is that if the certificate expired, the signature would not be trusted, even if it was time-stamped.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks, Bruce.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Raji Madduri <<a href="mailto:raji.madduri@oracle.com">raji.madduri@oracle.com</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, October 14, 2021 1:21 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Bruce Morton <<a href="mailto:Bruce.Morton@entrust.com">Bruce.Morton@entrust.com</a>><br>
<b>Cc:</b> javase-ca-request_ww_grp <<a href="mailto:javase-ca-request_ww_grp@oracle.com">javase-ca-request_ww_grp@oracle.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL] RE: Invalidity Date<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">WARNING: This email originated outside of Entrust.<br>
DO NOT CLICK links or attachments unless you trust the sender and know the content is safe.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center">
<hr size="1" width="100%" align="center">
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Bruce,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">In Java Web Start and Plug-in, with respect to signed code, if a certificate is revoked, we will not load that code, regardless of when it was revoked. In other words, we don't look at either the revocation date or the invalidity date.
We simply don't trust it if it is revoked.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoPlainText">Raji<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Bruce Morton <<a href="mailto:Bruce.Morton@entrust.com">Bruce.Morton@entrust.com</a>>
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, October 14, 2021 5:33 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Raji Madduri <<a href="mailto:raji.madduri@oracle.com">raji.madduri@oracle.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [External] : RE: Invalidity Date<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Raji,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Just following up on this request. I believe a ballot which will suggest that the CAs stop using invalidity date will soon be proposed. I would like to change the ballot, if this will impact Java signatures.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks, Bruce.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Bruce Morton <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, October 6, 2021 12:18 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Raji Madduri <<a href="mailto:raji.madduri@oracle.com">raji.madduri@oracle.com</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Invalidity Date<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Hi Raji,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Can you please advise if Java uses the invalidity date per RFC 5280, see
<a href="https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc5280*section-5.3.2__;Iw!!ACWV5N9M2RV99hQ!Ysj5IUx4t6IjHNJxLooKWVbWrCyJpeSeeyxLTEHx4LwHewlHMcBMN9C-t0gD-qHRiQ$">
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc5280#section-5.3.2</a>?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Windows does not use this date, so they request that we “back-date” the revocation date to support the invalidity date concept. Would like to know what to expect from Java.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Thanks, Bruce.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><i>Any email and files/attachments transmitted with it are confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If this message has been sent to you in error, you must not copy, distribute
or disclose of the information it contains. <u>Please notify Entrust immediately</u> and delete the message from your system.</i>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>